Houston Fire Department Apparatus

[Guest]

[quote name='fireman29b' timestamp='1312152836' post='450786']

Went with the Frazer ambulance lighting package...LOL

[/quote]







...RED AMBULANCE'S - would be nice!

[Txfirephoto]

I agree



[quote name='bpulley' timestamp='1312153122' post='450790']

...RED AMBULANCE'S - would be nice!

[/quote]

[TacSupport1]

Houston Fire Department

NEW Engine 12

"Moody Park"

2012 Ferrara Inferno



   

[Guest]

[quote name='TacSupport1' timestamp='1333497758' post='479892']

Houston Fire Department

NEW Engine 12

"Moody Park"

2012 Ferrara Inferno

[/quote]



Beautiful Engine. Thanks for sharing.

[firepost]

  I realize that no one has posted on this thread for a while but I was wondering if anyone on this site knows what a "Tap" company is supposed to be and is it something new.? I just found a site that had featured some company run downs on some Houston fires and a few of them had a couple of Engines under the title of "TAPs Dispatch" and generally speaking for a couple of Engine companies which were usually listed after the extra alarm companies were listed. This is for the Houston fire department of course.

 

 It is from the photo website Tac-7.com

Here's an example.http://tac-7.com/photos/2012-0723-0555/

[Guest]

  I realize that no one has posted on this thread for a while but I was wondering if anyone on this site knows what a "Tap" company is supposed to be and is it something new.? I just found a site that had featured some company run downs on some Houston fires and a few of them had a couple of Engines under the title of "TAPs Dispatch" and generally speaking for a couple of Engine companies which were usually listed after the extra alarm companies were listed. This is for the Houston fire department of course.

 

 It is from the photo website Tac-7.com

Here's an example.http://tac-7.com/photos/2012-0723-0555/

It has been around for quite a while, when requesting an additional engine and not needing a full additional alarm you can request "taps" each "tap" is an additional engine such as District 20 give me 4 taps on the fire.  A 5 tap was an additional ladder truck - you might hear District 8 give me 3 - 5/taps for a special call of 3 ladder trucks.

 

Today we have added "plain text" and the code 1-11 which can be requested prior to a second alarm or a 2-11.  The 1-11 has different response levels based on the type of structure such as a house vs. apartments etc. - hope that answers the question.

[firepost]

It has been around for quite a while, when requesting an additional engine and not needing a full additional alarm you can request "taps" each "tap" is an additional engine such as District 20 give me 4 taps on the fire.  A 5 tap was an additional ladder truck - you might hear District 8 give me 3 - 5/taps for a special call of 3 ladder trucks.

 

Today we have added "plain text" and the code 1-11 which can be requested prior to a second alarm or a 2-11.  The 1-11 has different response levels based on the type of structure such as a house vs. apartments etc. - hope that answers the question.

 Thanks that does help. I'm from Chicago which is probably where Houston got the idea of 2-11 and up from. In Chicago we don't have a 1-11 however. When we call for more equipment above a "still alarm" (structure fire) we call it a Still and Box alarm instead of a 1-11 alarm like you do in Houston. If we need any additional equipment without calling for an full extra alarm we just request what we need. It is sometimes known as a special call. You shouldn't confuse a special call with a special alarm however. In Chicago if we need more extra alarms above a 5-11 we call those alarms special alarms. So what some fire departments call a 7th alarm or in some cases a 7-11 , in Chicago we would call it a 5-11 alarm and 2 specials.

 

[ninjamedic2293]

 Thanks that does help. I'm from Chicago which is probably where Houston got the idea of 2-11 and up from. In Chicago we don't have a 1-11 however. When we call for more equipment above a "still alarm" (structure fire) we call it a Still and Box alarm instead of a 1-11 alarm like you do in Houston. If we need any additional equipment without calling for an full extra alarm we just request what we need. It is sometimes known as a special call. You shouldn't confuse a special call with a special alarm however. In Chicago if we need more extra alarms above a 5-11 we call those alarms special alarms. So what some fire departments call a 7th alarm or in some cases a 7-11 , in Chicago we would call it a 5-11 alarm and 2 specials.

 

Considering that the Houston Fire Department is 20 years older and only 6 stations shy of Chicago FD's size, it might be percieved as just a little arrogant to assume they "got the idea" from them don't you think?  Probably a common result from the technological limitations of the older dispatch systems.  Departments in the south dont just sit around with a box of tissue and a bottle of lotion watching Backdraft or the new CFD flavor of the week on TV trying to figure out how to fight fire . . . 

[Guest]

   

 

Firepost,

 

I would "guess" that the "tap" may go back to the time period prior to two-way radios when the Fire Alarm (Gamewell) System was the way to communicate.

 

I have seen some Gamewell fire alarm boxes with the "codes" on the inside of the box so the Chief or Company on scene could request different types of help or send different signals to communications. i.e. second alarm, false alarm, extra engine or truck, & etc.

 

Imagine before radio communications you had to respond to the "Box" just to find out what or where the emergency was. No canceling companies enroute because you had to get there to find out the scoop.

 

If you look at the attached photo (credit to original photographer) you can see the black button which would be used to "tap" a signal back to communications from the box itself.

 

Pretty cool if Houston has kept that tradition over all these years.

 

Well, that's my educated guess from someone outside of Houston.

 

Now back to Houston vs. Chicago

 

Semper Fidelis

RMK

 

 

[fyrfoto]

Considering that the Houston Fire Department is 20 years older and only 6 stations shy of Chicago FD's size, it might be percieved as just a little arrogant to assume they "got the idea" from them don't you think?  Probably a common result from the technological limitations of the older dispatch systems.  Departments in the south dont just sit around with a box of tissue and a bottle of lotion watching Backdraft or the new CFD flavor of the week on TV trying to figure out how to fight fire . . . 

 

 I wouldn't think it was necessarily arrogant to assume such a thing. After the north won the war, it graciously began sharing its knowledge with the south in an attempt to bring it out of the dark ages. This was viewed by those in the north as a charitable responsibility, much in the same way Sherman's March was an early form of urban renewal, as the north worked to civilize those less fortunate souls who don't have the luxury of a harsh winter to cleanse the soul.   

 

Now time to duck and cover

 

J

[Guest]

 Thanks that does help. I'm from Chicago which is probably where Houston got the idea of 2-11 and up from. In Chicago we don't have a 1-11 however. When we call for more equipment above a "still alarm" (structure fire) we call it a Still and Box alarm instead of a 1-11 alarm like you do in Houston. If we need any additional equipment without calling for an full extra alarm we just request what we need. It is sometimes known as a special call. You shouldn't confuse a special call with a special alarm however. In Chicago if we need more extra alarms above a 5-11 we call those alarms special alarms. So what some fire departments call a 7th alarm or in some cases a 7-11 , in Chicago we would call it a 5-11 alarm and 2 specials.

 

I can't say that we copy anybody, and we are our own unique animal.   The phrase "taps" go back to the original fire alarm box which remained in our downtown area until the late 1990's.

 

In Houston a "still alarm" is the response of a single engine.  A box alarm varies on the size or type of structure or incident.  Our box assignments are complex in definition from house to high-rise and extrication to haz-mat.  A 1-11 response for a house fire could be an additional Engine & Safety Officer to an additional Engine, Truck, Chief for a comercial building/apartments.  The 1-11 is not automatic and must be requested, our 2-11 response is quite large, the 1-11 is a smaller option for the IC.

[Guest]

The accents are different, the weather is different, even the trucks are different colors, but the job is still the same whether you live in Texas, illinois, or Anytown USA.  How you dispatch companies or how you call extra companies is each departments policy.  Sure, there are similarities, but each one is different.  Really, cant we all just get along?

[firepost]

The accents are different, the weather is different, even the trucks are different colors, but the job is still the same whether you live in Texas, illinois, or Anytown USA.  How you dispatch companies or how you call extra companies is each departments policy.  Sure, there are similarities, but each one is different.  Really, cant we all just get along?

 Yes , in fact I agree with you. I think that too much was being read into what I was saying as all that I was doing was pointing out the differences and the similarities between Chicago's and Houston's extra alarm designations. As most other cities and fire departments that I know of usually call their extra alarms 1st, 2nd and 3rds etc and I just found it interesting that just a few other fire departments use the "11" designation on their extra alarms like Chicago does. I think that New Orleans may also use the "11" designation on their extra alarms as well. As there aren't very many fire departments that actually use the "11" designation on their extra alarms I had found it be an interesting coincidence that two different fire departments in two different parts of the country should be using the "11" designation on their extra alarms. Years ago I had thought that only Chicago was using the "11" designation on their extra alarms.

  Being an avid and life long fan I find comparing the differences and similarities between fire departments to be very interesting. Another example as to a major terminology difference that I have found that in most fire departments a still alarm usually means a fire or a run that is reported directly from the fire station while in Chicago a still alarm is a full structure fire response that is usually called in via telephone.

It is amazing some of the questions and false assumptions that I have gotten from non fire fans over the years when I have used different extra alarm designations in my terminology. The most recent false assumption that I had heard was when some one recently told me that they had thought that a "5 alarm" was when they sent 5 fire engines to the fire. I had to explain the in most cases 4 or 5 pieces of apparatus was the normal response sent to the report of a possible structure fire.

  I find that Houston fire department to be one of the most interesting fire departments in the United States in fact I Iike the idea that (to my knowledge) all of their Aerial Ladders seem to be equipped with "pre piped waterways" in addition to their Tower Ladders, which allows them to initiate elevated streams more quickly.

[firepost]

 I believe that ( if I'm correct) that Houston Fire department''s  normal extra alarm policy had been to dispatch a Tower Ladder on the 2-11.

If that is still true is the Tower Ladder dispatched as  either the 3rd or 4th Truck on the 2-11 or is it dispatched as a 5th Truck (in addition to the 3rd and 4th Trucks) on the 2-11? 

<b> Is the Tower Ladder dispatch on the 2-11 still done automatically or does a Tower Ladder need to be requested first if it is not normally the 3rd or 4th due Truck?</b>

<b> </b>

<b>  I know that Houston will normally dispatch 2 trucks and 4 Engines on most extra alarms but will Tower Ladders be automatically be dispatched if the fire goes above a 2-11 or is that also done be request only? In other words what is the current Tower Ladder dispatch policy?</b>

<b>            Thanks in advance.</b>

[Guest]

 I believe that ( if I'm correct) that Houston Fire department''s  normal extra alarm policy had been to dispatch a Tower Ladder on the 2-11.

If that is still true is the Tower Ladder dispatched as  either the 3rd or 4th Truck on the 2-11 or is it dispatched as a 5th Truck (in addition to the 3rd and 4th Trucks) on the 2-11? 

<b> Is the Tower Ladder dispatch on the 2-11 still done automatically or does a Tower Ladder need to be requested first if it is not normally the 3rd or 4th due Truck?</b>

<b> </b>

<b>  I know that Houston will normally dispatch 2 trucks and 4 Engines on most extra alarms but will Tower Ladders be automatically be dispatched if the fire goes above a 2-11 or is that also done be request only? In other words what is the current Tower Ladder dispatch policy?</b>

<b>            Thanks in advance.</b>

 

The Houston Fire Department has (5) Towers located around the city - they are dispatched on all 2-11's and usually are the 3rd "ladder"  on the assignment.  All extra alarms 2-11 and above have 4 Engines & 2 Trucks.

 

All ladders respond to extrication and elevator assignments, Towers respond with a standard truck on above and below grade rescue.

 

Above the 2-11 they would have to be special called. 

[Frank B]

Taps can also be used to test the circuit  

[Ladder 68]

And yes all HFD trucks have prep-piped waterways; some standard 1000GPM rated models and some oversized 1500GPM rated models based upon when they were speced and purchased. Last aerials without pre-piped waterways, to my knowledge, where the 1983 Seagrave/3D 100' rigs.

 

As stated earlier the HFD box assignments are very different but everything is based on the structure type first, then the incident type. For instance a structure fire in a house gets 3/2/2 + EMS (+ Rescue Co. if reports of people trapped) while the same fire, reported in a MD or commercial, gets 4/2/2/1-Safety Officer (+Rescue Co. if reports of people trapped) + EMS and a Hi-Rise Box is 6/4/4/2 + EMS if I remember correctly. A House 1-11 is 1-Engine Co. and 1-District Chief while a 1-11 in a MD/commercial is 1/1/1 and somewhere in there a Rescue Co. is assigned (MD/Commercial) unless dispatched on the original box.

 

Confused yet? Like elsewhere, once you get acclimated it all makes sense.

 

Be safe.

[firepost]

 Yes I understand it Larry. Thanks for the information. Another thing that I like about the Houston Fire Department is that they have triple stage high pressure *high rise mode" pumpers (at station 8 and 2 the last I had heard). New York has been using them on designated companies for over 30 years and both Chicago and Houston just started using them the last few years in the 2000's.

 I haven't heard of any other cities that use them however that doesn't mean that no other cities have a few of them.

I don't think that the Los Angeles Fire Department  (City or County) had purchased any but I could be wrong. I realize that their triple stage pumps are only of use in high rise districts when the buildings pumps are out of commission or non existent. 

[Roto-Ray]

Fire-Alarm-box4.jpg

 

Firepost,

 

I would "guess" that the "tap" may go back to the time period prior to two-way radios when the Fire Alarm (Gamewell) System was the way to communicate.

 

I have seen some Gamewell fire alarm boxes with the "codes" on the inside of the box so the Chief or Company on scene could request different types of help or send different signals to communications. i.e. second alarm, false alarm, extra engine or truck, & etc.

 

Imagine before radio communications you had to respond to the "Box" just to find out what or where the emergency was. No canceling companies enroute because you had to get there to find out the scoop.

 

If you look at the attached photo (credit to original photographer) you can see the black button which would be used to "tap" a signal back to communications from the box itself.

 

I can remember hearing one of the Richmond (VA) BC's advise communications to "back-tap the box" when the fire was under control and companies were preparing to clear.  It was always cool to hear because no one else in the department did it.

[firepost]

Thanks Rotoray, Chicago first started  putting two way radio's on our rigs in the early 50's..so before then we also had to wait for everyone to show up at the scene of the alarm before they were returned.