Syracuse, New York

[Guest]

Spare Truck 9 was this 1976 Sutphen 1000/0/100 foot

[Guest]

MIni 10 had a 1989 International/KME 250/500

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Engine 10 had this 1986 Spartan/Saulsbury 2000/500/55 foot

[Guest]

Truck 5 operated a 1987 Sutphen 1000/0/100 foot

[Guest]

Parked at station 10 was this out of service 1975 Hendrickson/Pierce 1500/500/50 foot

[Guest]

Mini 12 had a 1984 GMC/3D 250/500

[Guest]

Engine 12 had a 1991 KME 2000/500/55 foot

[Guest]

Hazmat 1 was stationed at station 12 and was this 1989 Grumman/Saulsbury.  Still on the department today as the Mass Casualty Unit

[Guest]

Mini 17 had this 1984 GMC/3D 250/500

[Guest]

Engine 17 operated with a 1981 Spartan/E-One 2000/500/55 foot

[Guest]

Mini 18 had a 1981 GMC/3D 250/500

[Guest]

Engine 18 had another 1981 Spartan/E-One 2000/500/55 foot.

[Guest]

Out of Service at station 18 was this 1975 Hendrickson/Pierce 1500/500/50 foot.

[Guest]

Last one was Car 3, this Chevrolet.  Interesting that the chiefs used red vehicles while the rest of the fleet was Chrome yellow.

 

That was it for the tour of Syracuse Fire Department in 1992!

[ff002]

Parked at station 10 was this out of service 1975 Hendrickson/Pierce 1500/500/50 foot

Any chance this is a Sanford, Kenny? The treadplate corners and rear slope are classic Sanford.....(I could be wrong-wouldnt be the first time!)

[Guest]

Any chance this is a Sanford, Kenny? The treadplate corners and rear slope are classic Sanford.....(I could be wrong-wouldnt be the first time!)

You might be right Bruce,  I will check into it.

[SrFireOfficial]

Thanks for the vintage Syracuse stuff!

[foghog333]

Engine 3 was a 1980 Hendrickson Sanford with a 50 foot Redi Tower boom.


Tom Shand

Winchester, Virginia

[Guest]

Excellent photos through the entire thread. I've only been to the city a few times but have always liked the apparatus. And I will agree, the '86 Heavy Rescue is one of my all time favorites to this day.

So, I'm sure this is the right place to find some answers to questions I've had for years!

 

 I've heard many "unofficial" explanations over the years, but what was the original concept of the Engine and Mini combination? Or was it in fact a combination at all in the first place? I always assumed it was similar to the older Two piece companies that many cities operated with (Engine and Wagon) but never found the true answer.

 

Weren't the engines at one time called Maxi's or am I thinking of a different Dep't?

 

What was the reason for the Squrt option? Strictly for elevated master stream, or were there other factors?

 

I think the answer for the distinctive warning lights below the windshield/on the fenders is pretty self explanatory, but was there anything that lead to the determination to place them there? a specific incident or something similar?

 

Why have the Aerials remained Sutphens while the Engines have changed manufacturers over the years?

 

Thanks in advance for any answers.

[fyreline]

I'll attempt to answer the questions in the order you asked them:

 

(1) What was the original concept of the Engine and Mini combination? 

 

Answer: When the Syracuse Fire Department began its massive Reorganization Plan in the early 1970's, alarm data showed us that nearly 65% of the alarms received could have been handled by two personnel in a smaller, "Squad 51"-style vehicle. Bear in mind that at that point in time, the TV show "Emergency!" was not yet on the air, and the SFD was not yet running EMS alarms. That percentage breakdown proved to be true, and as EMS assumed more and more importance, the value of the smaller second piece was even more justified. On structure fire assignments, the mini responded with just one firefighter while the other three led with the engine. As it was discovered in later years that the minis did little or no actual firefighting at all, the pump and tank were deleted and they became strictly EMS first response units. When this change took place, the first-due engine on structure fire assignments stopped even taking it on the alarm, all four personnel riding the engine and leaving the mini in quarters. 

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<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">(2) Weren't the engines at one time called Maxi's or am I thinking of a different department?

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<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">Answer: Syracuse's two-piece engine company procedure was called the Mini-Maxi Concept in many contemporary fire service publications, but the engines have never been marked or dispatched as "Maxis". We have always just called them engines.

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<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">(3) What was the reason for the Squrt option? Strictly for elevated master stream, or were there other factors?

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Answer: It was determined that Syracuse's abundant and prolific water supply system (Over 6000 hydrants, all 80 lbs. or better and one of the reasons for our ISO Class 1 rating) could easily supply more elevated master streams than our truck companies could provide. Added to that, our typical Syracuse "job" is a deuce-and-a-half wood frame, balloon-construction house with asphalt shingles ("gasoline siding") and minimum setback and separation between houses. Although our initial tactics have always been - and continue to be - multiple 1.75" handlines quickly deployed and aggressively advanced, the capability of multiple elevated master streams is always a nice tool for the fireground commander to have in his box. At house fires it is highly effective if and when necessary, and at multiple alarm fires it is imperative and leads to faster, safer and more efficient conclusions.

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<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">(4) I think the answer for the distinctive warning lights below the windshield/on the fenders is pretty self explanatory, but was there anything that lead to the determination to place them there? a specific incident or something similar?

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<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">Answer: We actually originated these at Engine 7 when I was stationed there. E7 covered the high-density, high-traffic Syracuse University area and three of the city's major hospitals. We had noticed that on alarms, the cars simply didn't see our rooftop mounting lights - they were in effect shooting right over the heads of the traffic directly in front of us. Our thought was that putting a couple of big old-fashioned rotating lights (this was before light bars came into common use) down below the cab windshield would tend to get them noticed better by the cars in front of us - and it worked very well, in addition to providing what amounted to early intersection lights. No, there was no one particular incident that prompted their use.

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<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">(5) Why have the Aerials remained Sutphens while the Engines have changed manufacturers over the years?

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<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">Answer: When the Reorganization Plan was envisioned, the use of tower ladders was still relatively new and we looked at everything on the market. We had a tragic experience with an articulating-boom Snorkel in 1971, and Chief Tom Hanlon vowed that there would be no more articulating=boom apparatus on the SFD under his watch - and there have been none to this day. The Sutphen tower provided the right combination of reach, water flow, and available pump & tank capacity to meet our needs ad we have developed an extremely close and mutually beneficial relationship with Sutphen over the years. The reason we have such a mixed bag of engine makes is due to the competitive bid process, and the fact that Tom Sutphen would not build a rear-mounted anything - which put them out of the running for our TeleSqurt engines. During a couple of lean budget years in 2010-2011 we were unable to afford booms on any new engines, and we did acquire three non-boom equipped Sutphen engines (we have since gone back to booms on subsequent engines). We do not go to competitive bid for our tower ladders - we must receive a Waiver of Competitive Bid from the City Council, and in effect create legislation to buy each new tower. This always required me to testify before the council to justify the purchase to their satisfaction - something I was always able to successfully do. The short answer is that Sutphens work exceptionally well for us, our Truck Companies have used them exclusively for over 40 years, and we have an excellent relationship with them for parts, service and support.

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<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">Hope this information is helpful.

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<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">David B. Reeves

<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">Deputy Chief (Retired)

<p style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">Syracuse Fire Department 1973-2013