[quote name='Trevor' post='54831' date='Nov 29 2006, 15:36 ']from the movie "Backdraft" does engine 17 really exist?[/quote]
Engine 17 used to "exist" however.They were in service from February 16 1870 to January 16 1968 and for all of those 97 years and 11 months they were located 558 W Lake street,which was near the north east corner of Lake street and Jefferson which is just a few blocks west of our famous Loop and can still be considered downtown Chicago as there are alot of commercial developments includng condominiums in the area.While the firestation no longer exists it was at one time within easy walking distance of Truck 2's old quarters
at Washington and Clinton streets which was only two blocks south east of Engine 17's old quarters.
Truck 2 is now at Engine 5 which is only about 7 blocks south of Engine 17's old quarters.Neither Engine 17 nor Truck 2's Old quarter's are still standing,however.
Truck 46 was in service from May 1st 1928 until November 16 1971 at 4666 w Fulton,on the Far West Side near Lake Street and Cicero (about 2 blocks south east).There old firestation was closed in 1980 when Engine 67 moved into Engine 117's new station (a little less then a mile northwest).The last that I had read was that the building was converted into a church.The station was built in 1936.
The Chicago Fire Department had as many as 126 Engines at one time.Even though the highest numbered Engine company is 129,three of our Engine were actually Fire Boats in recent years. They were Engines 41,37 and 58.Only Engine (Fireboat 58)remains in service.We even had an Engine 130 in service during World War 2 at our Famous Navy Pier.As recent as 1960 Chicago had 123 Engine company's in service.Engine's 3 and 31 were taken out of service in the early to mid 1950's and Engine 90 had been out of service since 1932.
Many of our Engine company's were taken out of service during the 1960's, however several of them were taken out of service during the early 80's and since early 2004 we have taken 3 additional Engine company's out of service at an average of one a year.The major difference is that the last three Engines that were taken out of service were all replaced by new Company's.Engine 100 was replaced by Truck 6 in March of 2004 (which had been out of service since 1963),Engine 77 was replaced by Haz Mat 2 less then a year later and Engine 61 was replaced by Truck 12 just about a year ago.Truck 12 had been out of service since January 1 1992 which was the same day our Engine 20 was taken out of service.
The Chicago Fire Department currently has 95 Engine company's in service and 61 Truck company's in service while 3 years ago we had 98 Engines and 59 Trucks in service.
Our highest number Truck is Tower Ladder 63 and the two numbers that we currently are not using are Trucks 43 and 46 which ironically were both taken out of service on the same day November 16th 1971.
[quote name='Andrew2340' post='55045' date='Nov 30 2006, 17:14 ']Great thread everyone!!! Has anyone ever seen this apparatus in service with Chicago? According to the website, it once served with Chicago...
If the rig ever served in Chicago it had to have been a remounted body which was delivered on a 1980 GMC Chassis as the body looks very much like the one on two 1980 Gmc Foam Midi'pumpers that were assigned to Midway Airport and Meigs Field.
I have my doubts as there would have had to have been major body work done and they were 1980 models on GMC chassis.Check to see if the body was remounted and reworked.
12-10-2006, 03:59 AM (This post was last modified: 12-10-2006, 04:01 AM by wardengine.)
can someone fill me in ,i've been told by someone in chicago area that the movie engine 17 is privately owned in chicago area and the ward lafrance engine in northeastern PA,which they are trying to sell, that came from chicago as engine 17 was another engine from the city that was made as a stand in for the movie. is this true?? he also told me this engine was 40 something
tom bretz a ffII,retired disabled ff/emt from Kingston PA F D,own 2 wardlafranceengs a 49,a66,member of iaff 840,six cnty fire asso,pa state firemen's assoc, pa pump primers,schuylkill historic fire soc(spaamfaa's newest chapter--black diamond),luzerne cnty fire/rescue,life mem of columbian fire co kingston,former app op at laflin,edwrdsvlle,forty fort all in pa
I know the current owner of the original Ward/Ranger Engine 17 that was used in the movie "Backdraft". He used to be on the Code 3 boards. I don't want to give his name out, but he lives in Minnesota and also owns several other of the Ward/Rangers that were in the movie. He's currently in the process of restoring the Engine 17 rig.
As for the dept. in Pennsylvania who is trying to sell their "Engine 17". That is a former Chicago rig, but it WAS NOT used in the movie backdraft. The current owner of the real Engine 17 has the whole story on that rig, and doesn't think too much of that dept. in Penna. trying to pass their rig off as the real thing.
The only MARC in 46 ENGINE!
NEVER FORGET 9-11-01 F.D.N.Y. 343
RIP FF John Bellew 27 Truck F.D.N.Y. 1-23-05
RIP Captain Frank Keane 46 Engine F.D.N.Y 12-11-06
[quote name='Crossbronxxpress' post='57693' date='Dec 10 2006, 14:21 ']I know the current owner of the original Ward/Ranger Engine 17 that was used in the movie "Backdraft". He used to be on the Code 3 boards. I don't want to give his name out, but he lives in Minnesota and also owns several other of the Ward/Rangers that were in the movie. He's currently in the process of restoring the Engine 17 rig.
As for the dept. in Pennsylvania who is trying to sell their "Engine 17". That is a former Chicago rig, but it WAS NOT used in the movie backdraft. The current owner of the real Engine 17 has the whole story on that rig, and doesn't think too much of that dept. in Penna. trying to pass their rig off as the real thing.[/quote]
thank you,they are very persistant it was used in movie but after i got the story it wasn't they weren't very happy and still argue the point of it being the engine i was told what engine it was when it was in service but forgot i' pretty sure i was told it was 40something
anyway thanks for clarification. i appreciate it
tom bretz a ffII,retired disabled ff/emt from Kingston PA F D,own 2 wardlafranceengs a 49,a66,member of iaff 840,six cnty fire asso,pa state firemen's assoc, pa pump primers,schuylkill historic fire soc(spaamfaa's newest chapter--black diamond),luzerne cnty fire/rescue,life mem of columbian fire co kingston,former app op at laflin,edwrdsvlle,forty fort all in pa
[quote name='wardengine' post='57951' date='Dec 11 2006, 13:29 ']thank you,they are very persistant it was used in movie but after i got the story it wasn't they weren't very happy and still argue the point of it being the engine i was told what engine it was when it was in service but forgot i' pretty sure i was told it was 40something
anyway thanks for clarification. i appreciate it[/quote]
I believe the Pennsylvania Ward/Ranger was former Chicago Engine 34 if my memory serves me correct!
The only MARC in 46 ENGINE!
NEVER FORGET 9-11-01 F.D.N.Y. 343
RIP FF John Bellew 27 Truck F.D.N.Y. 1-23-05
RIP Captain Frank Keane 46 Engine F.D.N.Y 12-11-06
12-12-2006, 06:34 PM (This post was last modified: 12-12-2006, 06:43 PM by wardengine.)
here is reply from the pa fire co after i furnished updated info to them:
just to claerify a few things the company does have in its possession a letter from the city of chicago fire dept. and mayors office stating the engine was used in some parts of the movie other ward eones were also used. the trucks were used during different scenes of the movie. the rason we didnt remove the 17 from the engine is we had an agrrement when purchased to keep its authenticity for 7 years.
and another excerp:
Interesting discussion on the authenticity of the rig that is in Schuykill County. I found the following info on the Code 3 Collectibles Web Site:
"When Ron Howard filmed BACKDRAFT he made the Chicago Fire Department one of the most recognized departments in the country. The CFD loaned Universal Studios several pieces of apparatus for their new movie. It is very unusual for Hollywood to use actual authentic apparatus. Most movies using fire apparatus are filmed on the West Coast and use privately owned trucks painted to reflect the city they are meant to represent.
The most recognized engine from the movie would be Engine 17. Engine 17 started service with the Chicago Fire Department in July of 1970. This1970 Ward LaFrance Pumper was first assigned to Engine Co. 8. The pumper was later assigned to Engine 18. In 1987, it was refurbed with a Ranger cab and E\-One body before it was given to Ron Howard's production group in July of 1990. Ron Howard used Engine 18 (portrayed as Engines 17 & 51 in the movie) until February of 1991. After the filming of the movie, the apparatus was given to Engine 69 were it remained in-service until 1995 when it was disposed of."
This says that the "Backdraft Engine" began service in 1970 with a refurb in 1987 - the website trying to sell the engine in Schuylkill County lists the one they have as a 1968 model with the refurb by E\-One done in 1988? Also, according to Code 3's info, the engine used in the movie went back into service with the CFD in 1991 as Engine 69 - it remained there until 1995 - Interesting that they wouldn't have removed the "17" from the door during this time period?
Anybody have any additional info that might unravel this mystery? Were there two rigs used during the filming instead of just the one that Code 3 refers to?
tom bretz a ffII,retired disabled ff/emt from Kingston PA F D,own 2 wardlafranceengs a 49,a66,member of iaff 840,six cnty fire asso,pa state firemen's assoc, pa pump primers,schuylkill historic fire soc(spaamfaa's newest chapter--black diamond),luzerne cnty fire/rescue,life mem of columbian fire co kingston,former app op at laflin,edwrdsvlle,forty fort all in pa
[quote name='Crossbronxxpress' post='57693' date='Dec 10 2006, 14:21 ']I know the current owner of the original Ward/Ranger Engine 17 that was used in the movie "Backdraft". He used to be on the Code 3 boards. I don't want to give his name out, but he lives in Minnesota and also owns several other of the Ward/Rangers that were in the movie. He's currently in the process of restoring the Engine 17 rig.
As for the dept. in Pennsylvania who is trying to sell their "Engine 17". That is a former Chicago rig, but it WAS NOT used in the movie backdraft. The current owner of the real Engine 17 has the whole story on that rig, and doesn't think too much of that dept. in Penna. trying to pass their rig off as the real thing.[/quote]
Like i said before, the guy in Minnesota who currently owns the CFD Engine 69 Ward/Ranger (aka the real E-17 rig) also has the other Ward/Ranger that was used in Backdraft. I'm almost 100% positive that only his two rigs were the ONLY Ward/Rangers that were used in Backdraft. He knows ALL the particulars for EVERY Ward/Ranger that Chicago had.
And by the way, the Pennsylvania fire company with their "Engine 17" is pulling your chain with that supposed letter from the City of Chicago stating that the next owner had to keep it lettered for 7 years. That fire company bought that rig off of a body shop in Chicago who purchased it from the City of Chicago. The body shop refurbed it to look like the Engine 17 rig and sold it like that. I guess the PA. Fire Company is still too embarrased to admit that they were duped. Their rig was NEVER used in Backdraft. As a matter of fact, it's currently for sale on the Fenton Fire Apparatus website, minus the 17 on the door of course.
I'll call the guy in Minnesota tomorrow and see what he says.
The only MARC in 46 ENGINE!
NEVER FORGET 9-11-01 F.D.N.Y. 343
RIP FF John Bellew 27 Truck F.D.N.Y. 1-23-05
RIP Captain Frank Keane 46 Engine F.D.N.Y 12-11-06
[quote name='wardengine' post='58204' date='Dec 12 2006, 16:35 ']here is reply from the pa fire co after i furnished updated info to them:
just to claerify a few things the company does have in its possession a letter from the city of chicago fire dept. and mayors office stating the engine was used in some parts of the movie other ward eones were also used. the trucks were used during different scenes of the movie. the rason we didnt remove the 17 from the engine is we had an agrrement when purchased to keep its authenticity for 7 years.
and another excerp:
Interesting discussion on the authenticity of the rig that is in Schuykill County. I found the following info on the Code 3 Collectibles Web Site:
"When Ron Howard filmed BACKDRAFT he made the Chicago Fire Department one of the most recognized departments in the country. The CFD loaned Universal Studios several pieces of apparatus for their new movie. It is very unusual for Hollywood to use actual authentic apparatus. Most movies using fire apparatus are filmed on the West Coast and use privately owned trucks painted to reflect the city they are meant to represent.
The most recognized engine from the movie would be Engine 17. Engine 17 started service with the Chicago Fire Department in July of 1970. This1970 Ward LaFrance Pumper was first assigned to Engine Co. 8. The pumper was later assigned to Engine 18. In 1987, it was refurbed with a Ranger cab and E\-One body before it was given to Ron Howard's production group in July of 1990. Ron Howard used Engine 18 (portrayed as Engines 17 & 51 in the movie) until February of 1991. After the filming of the movie, the apparatus was given to Engine 69 were it remained in-service until 1995 when it was disposed of."
This says that the "Backdraft Engine" began service in 1970 with a refurb in 1987 - the website trying to sell the engine in Schuylkill County lists the one they have as a 1968 model with the refurb by E\-One done in 1988? Also, according to Code 3's info, the engine used in the movie went back into service with the CFD in 1991 as Engine 69 - it remained there until 1995 - Interesting that they wouldn't have removed the "17" from the door during this time period?
Anybody have any additional info that might unravel this mystery? Were there two rigs used during the filming instead of just the one that Code 3 refers to?[/quote]
[b]They did remove the number 17 from the door while it was at Engine 69.That's another reason why I would be skeptical of the story from Pennsylvania.
The first time that i ever visited Chicago was in June of '95. My first day there i stopped by the Chicago FD repair shops (pretty cool place). The Engine 69 Ward/Ranger had just been taken out of service and was parked out back. I have several pictures of it, and if i can figure out how to resize my pics someday, i'll post them.
The only MARC in 46 ENGINE!
NEVER FORGET 9-11-01 F.D.N.Y. 343
RIP FF John Bellew 27 Truck F.D.N.Y. 1-23-05
RIP Captain Frank Keane 46 Engine F.D.N.Y 12-11-06
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