Ya make me feel old Dennis.. I had the same list I bought it at Mundlein from Bill F .
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Fantastic info, Dennis! Thanks for posting. <img src='http://www.firepics.net/groupboards/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/hail.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='
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[quote name='GA_Dave' date='25 January 2010 - 08:03 PM' timestamp='1264470236' post='360479']
I'm doing a little research on the Chicago Snorkels. There were three 1974 Oshkosh/Pierce 75' Snorkels with 1250 GPM pumps and a 1982 Seagrave/Pierce 85' Snorkel with a 1500 GPM pump. Does anyone know if these rigs carried water and if they did, how much? The 1974's were assigned to Snorkels 3, 4, and 5 when new. They also were assigned to Squads 1A, 2A and 5A later in life. Does anyone know which original Snorkel went to which Squad? Even though it is a special call apparatus now, has the 1982 rig ever been assigned as anything other than "Snorkel 1"? Thanks! [/quote] One of the three 1974 Oshkosh/Pierce 75-foot snorkels tipped over on Chicago's south side only about a year after it was delivered, I was told. I believe a firefighter may have died in the incident. I don't believe that snorkel ever returned to serve the CFD. Corrections welcome. As per an e-mail I received from William Post a few years back, it was on September 19, 1983 that Chicago went from having six separate squads and six separate snorkel companies (each in the same district number, but not at the same station) to having three Squads (1, 2 and 6) that were joined by the same numbered snorkel to run as a two-piece Squad company (Squad 6 was renumbered Squad 5 a couple years later). This, I believe, is the time period where the 75' snorkels were used as the second piece of the squad company. In the spring of 1987, two new Spartan/E-One 55' snorkels were delivered and Squads 1 and 2 went back to one-piece squads. The 1975 Hendrickson 55' (old SS-1) joined Squad 5 and remained a two-piece squad company. During 1988, a third Spartan/E-One 55' was received for Squad 5, but within a few months it was totaled and they went back to using the 1975 Henrickson 55' as Squad 5. Confusing- yes indeed. Again, corrections are welcome. 
[quote name='firebuff55407' date='26 January 2010 - 04:34 PM' timestamp='1264544082' post='360606']
One of the three 1974 Oshkosh/Pierce 75-foot snorkels tipped over on Chicago's south side only about a year after it was delivered, I was told. I believe a firefighter may have died in the incident. I don't believe that snorkel ever returned to serve the CFD. Corrections welcome. As per an e-mail I received from William Post a few years back, it was on September 19, 1983 that Chicago went from having six separate squads and six separate snorkel companies (each in the same district number, but not at the same station) to having three Squads (1, 2 and 6) that were joined by the same numbered snorkel to run as a two-piece Squad company (Squad 6 was renumbered Squad 5 a couple years later). This, I believe, is the time period where the 75' snorkels were used as the second piece of the squad company. In the spring of 1987, two new Spartan/E-One 55' snorkels were delivered and Squads 1 and 2 went back to one-piece squads. The 1975 Hendrickson 55' (old SS-1) joined Squad 5 and remained a two-piece squad company. During 1988, a third Spartan/E-One 55' was received for Squad 5, but within a few months it was totaled and they went back to using the 1975 Henrickson 55' as Squad 5. Confusing- yes indeed. Again, corrections are welcome. [/quote] This is a correction. The CFD actually had four and not three(Oshkosh Pierce Snorkels that were virtually the same model however the first one was a 1972 model which was originally assigned to Snorkel 3 at Engine 60's house. It was the original 1972 model that had "flipped over" about a year after it was delivered. It was first taken of service and used as a spare reserve Snorkel where it was stored at Engine 11's house on Cumberland avenue for at least a few years. Approximately around 1979/80 it was put back in service as a front line Snorkel Company where it was reassigned to Snorkel 6 after they were moved from Engine 110 to Engine 112's new station in March of 1979. In July of 1980 they were relocated to Engine 106's quarters and on May 25 1981 they were renumbered as the "New" Snorkel 3 and were relocated to Engine 83's house. In September of 1982 they were relocated to Engine 124's house where they stayed until it was taken out of service as Snorkel 3 on September 19 1983. After mid 1979 the CFD was using all four Oshkosh Pierce Snorkels in frontline service until September 19 1983 when the three 1974 models became the second pieces to the "new" 2 Piece ,Squad Companies at the time. 
Dennis thanks for posting that great listing.
John Hinant
Retired Member of Richmond VA Fire Bureau October 25, 1858 - October 25, 2020 = 162 years old The sixth oldest paid, documented, Fire Department in the United States First established in 1782 "In God We Trust - All Others We Take For Granted"
[quote name='firepost' date='26 January 2010 - 10:05 PM' timestamp='1264563930' post='360697']
This is a correction. The CFD actually had four and not three(Oshkosh Pierce Snorkels that were virtually the same model however the first one was a 1972 model which was originally assigned to Snorkel 3 at Engine 60's house. It was the original 1972 model that had "flipped over" about a year after it was delivered. It was first taken of service and used as a spare reserve Snorkel where it was stored at Engine 11's house on Cumberland avenue for at least a few years. Approximately around 1979/80 it was put back in service as a front line Snorkel Company where it was reassigned to Snorkel 6 after they were moved from Engine 110 to Engine 112's new station in March of 1979. In July of 1980 they were relocated to Engine 106's quarters and on May 25 1981 they were renumbered as the "New" Snorkel 3 and were relocated to Engine 83's house. In September of 1982 they were relocated to Engine 124's house where they stayed until it was taken out of service as Snorkel 3 on September 19 1983. After mid 1979 the CFD was using all four Oshkosh Pierce Snorkels in frontline service until September 19 1983 when the three 1974 models became the second pieces to the "new" 2 Piece ,Squad Companies at the time. [/quote] I personally am not 100% sure if the original 1972 Oshkosh Pierce Snorkel had actually "flipped over" but it was involved in a mishap of some kind, so that when the three 1974 models were delivered one the 1974 models had replaced it at Snorkel 3 (at Engine 60's house). I do know that the 1972 Oshkosh Pierce was involved in fighting the famous L.Fish and Levey ink Division (of the Cities corporation)fire on Sunday May 27 of 1973.Whether the "mishap" had occured at that fire I'm not 100% sure but it may have occured there.That fire was something like a 5-11 and 5 or 6 special alarm fire which had involved several structures in an industrial park on the southwest side which was supposed to have begun during a lightning storm.
I appreciate all the comments and info about the 24 Chicago Snorkels. I now have a much better mental picture of them. I have located photos of most, but still lack a few.
Snorkel 1's 1958 GMC/Pierce 50' Pitman BEFORE assignment to Snorkel Squad 3 Snorkel Squad 2's 1957/62 IHC VCO/Erlinder 40' Strato-Tower Snorkel 3's 1959 Ford/Mobile Aerial Towers 65' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 4's 1966 IHC CO-8190/Pierce 75' Pitman If anyone has pics of these, please post them. Thanks!
[quote name='GA_Dave' date='25 January 2010 - 08:03 PM' timestamp='1264470236' post='360479']
I'm doing a little research on the Chicago Snorkels. There were three 1974 Oshkosh/Pierce 75' Snorkels with 1250 GPM pumps and a 1982 Seagrave/Pierce 85' Snorkel with a 1500 GPM pump. Does anyone know if these rigs carried water and if they did, how much? The 1974's were assigned to Snorkels 3, 4, and 5 when new. They also were assigned to Squads 1A, 2A and 5A later in life. Does anyone know which original Snorkel went to which Squad? Even though it is a special call apparatus now, has the 1982 rig ever been assigned as anything other than "Snorkel 1"? Thanks! [/quote] The 1982 segrave is still active and in the pictures that were posted of the 3-11 the other day
[quote name='GA_Dave' date='28 January 2010 - 04:52 PM' timestamp='1264717969' post='360951']
I appreciate all the comments and info about the 24 Chicago Snorkels. I now have a much better mental picture of them. I have located photos of most, but still lack a few. Snorkel 1's 1958 GMC/Pierce 50' Pitman BEFORE assignment to Snorkel Squad 3 Snorkel Squad 2's 1957/62 IHC VCO/Erlinder 40' Strato-Tower Snorkel 3's 1959 Ford/Mobile Aerial Towers 65' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 4's 1966 IHC CO-8190/Pierce 75' Pitman If anyone has pics of these, please post them. Thanks! [/quote] [b]Dave you have the numbers wrong as far the total number of Snorkels that the CFD had owned.The CFD had owned a total of 26, not 24 Snorkels which includes the three HME Central States 55 foot Snorkels that are currently running on the Squads that are located in the city proper and Reserve Snorkel 1 (the 1982 Seagrave Pierce 85 footer). I have a hunch that the two Snorkels that you might have missed was the 55 foot Snorkel that was retrofitted on Engine 12 at O'Hare Field around 1980 and subsequently ran first as Squad 6 and then as Squad 7 until 1988 when it was replaced with a Heavy Duty Spartan /Supervac Rescue Squad and the other Snorkel that you may have missed was the Original Oshkosh Pierce 75 footer that was a 1972 Model that I had wrote about in a few recent post's on Chicago's Snorkels. So even though you have the three 1974 Oshkosh Pierce Snorkels listed you probably overlooked the 1972 model.[/b]
[quote name='firepost' date='31 January 2010 - 04:00 AM' timestamp='1264930804' post='361346']
[b]Dave you have the numbers wrong as far the total number of Snorkels that the CFD had owned.The CFD had owned a total of 25, not 24 Snorkels which includes the three HME Central States 55 foot Snorkels that are currently running on the Squads that are located in the city proper and Reserve Snorkel 1 (the 1982 Seagrave Pierce 85 footer). I have a hunch that the Snorkel or Snorkels that you might have missed was the 55 foot Snorkel that was retrofitted onto Engine 12 which ran at O'Hare Field around 1980 and subsequently ran first as Squad 6 and then as Squad 7 until 1988 when it was replaced with a Heavy Duty Spartan /Supervac Rescue Squad or you may have missed the Original Oshkosh Pierce 75 footer that was a 1972 Model that I had wrote about in a few recent post's on Chicago's Snorkels. So even though you have the three 1974 Oshkosh Pierce Snorkels listed you probably overlooked the 1972 model.[/b] [/quote]This was a numerical correction as I when I did a recount I found that the CFD had owned 25 Snorkels and not 26 or 24.
Nope, I have all of those, still only come up with 24. Here's the list I have....
1958 GMC 354 Pierce 0/0/50' Pitman Snorkel 1 1959 Ford F-800 Mobile Aerial Towers 0/0/75' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 2 1959 Ford F-800 Mobile Aerial Towers 0/0/65' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 3 1960 Ford F-950 Mobile Aerial Towers 0/0/85' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 4 1960 Ford F-950 Mobile Aerial Towers 0/0/85' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 5 1960 Ford F Erlinder 0/0/85' Strato-Tower Snorkel 6 1962 IHC VCO-196 Erlinder 0/0/40' Strato-Tower Snorkel Squad 1 1962 IHC VCO-196 Erlinder 0/0/40' Strato-Tower Snorkel Squad 2 1966 IHC CO-8190 Pierce 0/0/75' Pitman Snorkel 4 1967 Mack MB-600 Pierce 0/0/50' Pitman Snorkel Squad 1 1970 Ford C Pierce 1000/500/55' Pitman Snorkel 3 1972 Oshkosh A-1838 Pierce 1250/?/75' Pitman Snorkel 3 1974 Oshkosh A-1838 Pierce 1250/?/75' Pitman Snorkel 3 1974 Oshkosh A-1838 Pierce 1250/?/75' Pitman Snorkel 4 1974 Oshkosh A-1838 Pierce 1250/?/75' Pitman Snorkel 5 1975 Hendrickson 1871S Pierce 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 1 1975 Oshkosh A-1838 FMC 1250/500/300H/55' Pitman Squad 7 1982 Seagrave PC Pierce 1500/?/85' Pitman Snorkel 1 1987 Spartan Gladiator E\-One 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 1 1987 Spartan Gladiator E\-One 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 2 1988 Spartan Gladiator E\-One 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 5 2000 HME SFO Central States 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 1A 2000 HME SFO Central States 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 2A 2000 HME SFO Central States 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 5A
[quote name='GA_Dave' date='31 January 2010 - 09:51 AM' timestamp='1264951915' post='361370']
Nope, I have all of those, still only come up with 24. Here's the list I have.... 1958 GMC 354 Pierce 0/0/50' Pitman Snorkel 1 1959 Ford F-800 Mobile Aerial Towers 0/0/75' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 2 1959 Ford F-800 Mobile Aerial Towers 0/0/65' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 3 1960 Ford F-950 Mobile Aerial Towers 0/0/85' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 4 1960 Ford F-950 Mobile Aerial Towers 0/0/85' Hi-Ranger Snorkel 5 1960 Ford F Erlinder 0/0/85' Strato-Tower Snorkel 6 1962 IHC VCO-196 Erlinder 0/0/40' Strato-Tower Snorkel Squad 1 1962 IHC VCO-196 Erlinder 0/0/40' Strato-Tower Snorkel Squad 2 1966 IHC CO-8190 Pierce 0/0/75' Pitman Snorkel 4 1967 Mack MB-600 Pierce 0/0/50' Pitman Snorkel Squad 1 1970 Ford C Pierce 1000/500/55' Pitman Snorkel 3 1972 Oshkosh A-1838 Pierce 1250/?/75' Pitman Snorkel 3 1974 Oshkosh A-1838 Pierce 1250/?/75' Pitman Snorkel 3 1974 Oshkosh A-1838 Pierce 1250/?/75' Pitman Snorkel 4 1974 Oshkosh A-1838 Pierce 1250/?/75' Pitman Snorkel 5 1975 Hendrickson 1871S Pierce 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 1 1975 Oshkosh A-1838 FMC 1250/500/300H/55' Pitman Squad 7 1982 Seagrave PC Pierce 1500/?/85' Pitman Snorkel 1 1987 Spartan Gladiator E\-One 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 1 1987 Spartan Gladiator E\-One 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 2 1988 Spartan Gladiator E\-One 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 5 2000 HME SFO Central States 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 1A 2000 HME SFO Central States 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 2A 2000 HME SFO Central States 0/0/55' Pitman Snorkel Squad 5A [/quote] Dave- I believe you're missing the second 1960 Ford/Strato Tower 85' that was assigned to Snorkel 7, which I believe was CFD G#168. Quote: I believe you're missing the second 1960 Ford/Strato Tower 85' that was assigned to Snorkel 7, which I believe was CFD G#168. WHAT??? No picture? <img src='http://www.firepics.net/groupboards/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='  ' /> Didn't ever see anything about that one. Corrections made. Thanks!
[quote name='firebuff55407' date='31 January 2010 - 11:35 AM' timestamp='1264958136' post='361388']
Dave- I believe you're missing the second 1960 Ford/Strato Tower 85' that was assigned to Snorkel 7, which I believe was CFD G#168. [/quote] Yes that's the one that was missing, Steve, it was Snorkel 7's Strato Tower that was destroyed on July 7th 1970 when the Wall of a Multi story Industrial building collapsed on it when it was pouring water on the ruins. Unfortunately a firefighter, John Walsh was killed. By the way both 1960 Strato Towers were not 85 footers but I believe that they were 65 footers.
[quote name='firepost' date='31 January 2010 - 11:53 AM' timestamp='1264959180' post='361391']
Yes that's the one that was missing, Steve, it was Snorkel 7's Strato Tower that was destroyed on July 7th 1970 when the Wall of a Multi story Industrial building collapsed on it when it was pouring water on the ruins. Unfortunately a firefighter, John Walsh was killed. By the way both 1960 Strato Towers were not 85 footers but I believe that they were 65 footers. [/quote] I have corrected my roster to read 65-foot for both Snorkel 6 and 7. I had wondered why I never got a photo of Snorkel 7. It was destroyed by the time Duane Troxel and I shot the entire Chicago department in the fall of 1970. Thanks for the info Bill, for the photo of her Steve, and for bringing it all up Dave. I had the scare of my life when riding up in her twin, Snorkel 6, at CFD Station 46 in 1970 with Duane Troxel. Duane rode up first- no problems. When I got all of the way up so that I could take photos of the area and Engine 46 and Truck 17 both parked below, the controls of Snorkel 6 locked up some how. When the driver tried to unjam it, the bucket just swayed from side to side. Being a guy that is not exactly good with heights, it was extremely scary for me. Duane, of course, was rolling on the ground laughing at my plight 65-feet above. For awhile, I thought I might have to come down on Truck 17's aerial. Luckily, however, the driver figured out what the problem was. After that incident, I had a lot more respect for the firefighters operating in the snorkel basket. -1970 Photo by Steve Skaar. Duane can be seen on Truck 17's turntable in this photo taken before we got all the way up- and stuck.
nice shot of the old ladder. what a pity the old ambulance is hidden
[quote name='GA_Dave' date='25 January 2010 - 08:03 PM' timestamp='1264470236' post='360479']
I'm doing a little research on the Chicago Snorkels. There were three 1974 Oshkosh/Pierce 75' Snorkels with 1250 GPM pumps and a 1982 Seagrave/Pierce 85' Snorkel with a 1500 GPM pump. Does anyone know if these rigs carried water and if they did, how much? The 1974's were assigned to Snorkels 3, 4, and 5 when new. They also were assigned to Squads 1A, 2A and 5A later in life. Does anyone know which original Snorkel went to which Squad? Even though it is a special call apparatus now, has the 1982 rig ever been assigned as anything other than "Snorkel 1"? Thanks! [/quote] I believe that the Oshkosh Pierce 75 foot Snorkels had 500 gallon booster tanks and that the 1982 Seagrave was built with a 300 gallon tank according to what I had read , however I wonder myself if they ever had run with those tanks full of water as they were never used as true Quints or for that matter they weren't even used as Truck companies unlike most other cities that had used their "Snorkels" as Truck companies. This is what I know about the assignments of the 1974 Oshkosh/Pierce 75' Snorkels. I don't have a complete list with the shop number assignment's however, so while this is probably accurate I don't have the shop numbers to verify it. The 1974 Oshkosh from Snorkel 3 ultimately became Squad 5A after first becoming new Snorkel 5,6 and Squad 6A. The 1974 Oshkosh from Snorkel 4 ultimately became Squad 2A after first becoming new Snorkel 2. The 1974 Oshkosh from Snorkel 5 ultimately became Squad 1A after first becoming new Snorkel 1 and then going to new Snorkel 3 or 4 before going to Squad 1. The 1982 Seagrave/Pierce Snorkel which had been assigned to new Snorkel 1, technically speaking was on Squad 1 A for a short period of time before it became a Reserve Snorkel and was replaced by the 1974 Oshkosh/Pierce Snorkel which was originally Snorkel 4's apparatus.
[quote name='firepost' date='31 January 2010 - 02:16 PM' timestamp='1264967811' post='361413']
I believe that the Oshkosh Pierce 75 foot Snorkels had 500 gallon booster tanks and that the 1982 Seagrave was built with a 300 gallon tank according to what I had read , however I wonder myself if they ever had run with those tanks full of water as they were never used as true Quints or for that matter they weren't even used as Truck companies unlike most other cities that had used their "Snorkels" as Truck companies. This is what I know about the assignments of the 1974 Oshkosh/Pierce 75' Snorkels. I don't have a complete list with the shop number assignment's however, so while this is probably accurate I don't have the shop numbers to verify it. The 1974 Oshkosh from Snorkel 3 ultimately became Squad 5A after first becoming new Snorkel 5,6 and Squad 6A. The 1974 Oshkosh from Snorkel 4 ultimately became Squad 2A after first becoming new Snorkel 2. The 1974 Oshkosh from Snorkel 5 ultimately became Squad 1A after first becoming new Snorkel 1 and then going to new Snorkel 3 or 4 before going to Squad 1. The 1982 Seagrave/Pierce Snorkel which had been assigned to new Snorkel 1, technically speaking was on Squad 1 A for a short period of time before it became a Reserve Snorkel and was replaced by the 1974 Oshkosh/Pierce Snorkel which was originally Snorkel 4's apparatus. [/quote] The 1982 Seagrave only ran as Squad 1A for about a day or so after the new 2 Piece Squad went in service on Sept 19 1983 so that "short period of time" that I mentioned really doesn't count. It officially was designated as a Reserve Snorkel after that.
Thanks to all for the updated info and to Steve for the pic of Snorkel 7. I still question the correct size of Snorkels 6 and 7. The Iconografix book shows Snorkel 6 as an 85' Strato-Tower, which is where I got that info. You say they were 65' instead. I have compared photos with known 65' and 85' Strato-Towers from other FD's and with the 55' and 75' Pitmans and I believe that the Chicago Strato-Towers may have been 75' units. They appear to be too long to only be 65'. Can anyone verify what size they were, perhaps from an old roster or other document?
I'm still hunting photos of SS-2's 1957/62 IHC/Erlinder and Snorkel 4's 1966 IHC/Pierce. |
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