FDNY New pumpers.........

[hp1530]

[quote name='FDNYTRUCKS.com' timestamp='1344544047' post='494689']

if they are building them the cart is way ahead of the horse. bid has not been awarded. lets jump ahead and suppose they did get it, the scenario you described is exactly what will happen. their bread and butter sales to small departments will have to wait in line. and those sales will go elsewhere. and then the warranty issues begin on the big city rigs. and then the company goes down the drain. ALF 1985... Ward 79 1990... why KME would want the headache of dealing with the issues that occur with the warranty is beyond me. I guess nobody from Nesquehoning has ever driven the streets of NYC. the rigs in LA will last 30 years because the streets are glass smooth. the streets of NYC outside Manhattan look like the B-17's just made a bombing run, and that alone beats the hell out of the rig. not to mention the Winter conditions.

[/quote]



I thought the bid was won by KME but they had to work out the warranty details before the contract would be finalized. At least that is what I have heard/read.



Not all of LA County streets are nice but a majority of them are aright and LA City tends to resurface the roads every so often and aggressively repair potholes. Also got take into account there's no snow or salt as well.

[Dickey]

[quote name='FDNYTRUCKS.com' timestamp='1344544047' post='494689']

if they are building them the cart is way ahead of the horse. bid has not been awarded. lets jump ahead and suppose they did get it, the scenario you described is exactly what will happen. their bread and butter sales to small departments will have to wait in line. and those sales will go elsewhere. and then the warranty issues begin on the big city rigs. and then the company goes down the drain. ALF 1985... Ward 79 1990... why KME would want the headache of dealing with the issues that occur with the warranty is beyond me. I guess nobody from Nesquehoning has ever driven the streets of NYC. the rigs in LA will last 30 years because the streets are glass smooth. the streets of NYC outside Manhattan look like the B-17's just made a bombing run, and that alone beats the hell out of the rig. not to mention the Winter conditions.

[/quote]



[quote name='MFR86' timestamp='1344533358' post='494674']

We are in the middle of having a KME built for us and we were told it is going to take a while because they are building the FDNY rigs.

[/quote]





This is crap!!



It should be first come, first served. They will loose lots of business if KME decides to play favorites. <img src='http://www.firepics.net/groupboards/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' />

[BFD190]

Mike ill ask you... do you know how well they work in philly... piss poor streets, bad winters. Heavy call volume for certain companies.... sound somewhat familiar . If I asked what kind of plastic some light uses for a lens I would get inundated with responses ...

[jpw25pfd]

[quote name='BFD190' timestamp='1344613751' post='494770']

Mike ill ask you... do you know how well they work in philly... piss poor streets, bad winters. Heavy call volume for certain companies.... sound somewhat familiar . If I asked what kind of plastic some light uses for a lens I would get inundated with responses ...

[/quote]

The KME's in Philadelphia are holding up ok. When the first generation was delivered in 1995, twenty pieces, there were quite a few issues. Once those issues were corrected the engines were satisfactory. The latest batch, nineteen 2012 pumps, are doing well. There were a few minor issues with two of them but everything appears to be on track now.

[BFD190]

Thanks.. I assume its failry safe to use philly as a comparable location in terms of road and wheather conditions.

[Reliance]

[quote name='BFD190' timestamp='1344631555' post='494779']

Thanks.. I assume its failry safe to use philly as a comparable location in terms of road and wheather conditions.

[/quote]

Also Boston seems to be switching from E\-One to KME.

[e290l103]

look at from a business point of view. you have a 50 million dollar order and a 400,000 order. who gets priority? In the thought that they theoretically get an order, what will their production capacity be.





[quote name='Dickey' timestamp='1344570508' post='494756']









This is crap!!



It should be first come, first served. They will loose lots of business if KME decides to play favorites. <img src='http://www.firepics.net/groupboards/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' />

[/quote]

[ff168577]

[quote name='FDNYTRUCKS.com' timestamp='1344655281' post='494842']

look at from a business point of view. you have a 50 million dollar order and a 400,000 order. who gets priority? In the thought that they theoretically get an order, what will their production capacity be.

[/quote]





You also have to remember that like Pierce, KME has several production locations. It could also mean for KME adding an extra shift, there for hires new employees and helping the economy. It could be a win in several situations no matter who gets the job. I think Seagrave bidded themselves to high on purpose to get out of New York because of the warranty issues. I am sorry, but if you build a strong decent truck with reliable parts, and assembled correction and make it (firefighter proof), you should not loose money on your own work. Just my opinion.

[Guest]

[quote name='ff168577' timestamp='1344680559' post='494849']







You also have to remember that like Pierce, KME has several production locations. It could also mean for KME adding an extra shift, there for hires new employees and helping the economy. It could be a win in several situations no matter who gets the job. I think Seagrave bidded themselves to high on purpose to get out of New York because of the warranty issues. I am sorry, but if you build a strong decent truck with reliable parts, and assembled correction and make it (firefighter proof), you should not loose money on your own work. Just my opinion.

[/quote]



Its not a matter of loosing money on your own work. These trucks take an incredible amount of abuse in most parts of NYC. They would have to build a bomb proof truck, and even then it would get broken. My police command covers half the subways in the Bronx, we have had a GMC van for the last year and a half. It now has almost 70,000 miles on it, and is on its last legs.

[Roto-Ray]

[quote name='ff168577' timestamp='1344680559' post='494849']

You also have to remember that like Pierce, KME has several production locations.[/quote]

I know they build the aerials for the ladder trucks in Roanoke, VA. Where are their other facilities outside of Nesquehoning, PA?

[e290l103]

[quote name='ff168577' timestamp='1344680559' post='494849']



I think Seagrave gave the most realistic price in terms of what it will actually cost to build and warranty the order. is it high, yes, but it pretty closely represents actual cost factors







You also have to remember that like Pierce, KME has several production locations. It could also mean for KME adding an extra shift, there for hires new employees and helping the economy. It could be a win in several situations no matter who gets the job. I think Seagrave bidded themselves to high on purpose to get out of New York because of the warranty issues. I am sorry, but if you build a strong decent truck with reliable parts, and assembled correction and make it (firefighter proof), you should not loose money on your own work. Just my opinion.

[/quote]

[ff168577]

[quote name='Roto-Ray' timestamp='1344697264' post='494858']

I know they build the aerials for the ladder trucks in Roanoke, VA. Where are their other facilities outside of Nesquehoning, PA?

[/quote]



I believe or was told and thought they had a smaller shop in CA for the La county stuff.

[GA_Dave]

[quote name='ff168577' timestamp='1344699773' post='494863']

I believe or was told and thought they had a smaller shop in CA for the La county stuff.

[/quote]



They do have a shop in CA, but it is a service center, not a manufacturing facility.

[url="http://www.firepics.net/groupboards/index.php?app=forums&module=forums&section=findpost&pid=494674"][/url]MFR86, on 09 August 2012 - 01:49 PM, said:



We are in the middle of having a KME built for us and we were told it is going to take a while because they are building the FDNY rigs.

Since they have not been awarded a contract by FDNY, someone lied to you! I recently visited the KME factory. They are well below full capacity, compared to what I have seen on previous visits. I think they will easily be able to increase production to fill the FDNY contract, if they get it, and keep the current schedule for everyone else.

[Guest]

[quote name='GA_Dave' timestamp='1344781813' post='494960']

They do have a shop in CA, but it is a service center, not a manufacturing facility.







Since they have not been awarded a contract by FDNY, someone lied to you! I recently visited the KME factory. They are well below full capacity, compared to what I have seen on previous visits. I think they will easily be able to increase production to fill the FDNY contract, if they get it, and keep the current schedule for everyone else.

[/quote]

On an update...our potential order is on hold due to a technicality so apparently all of the previously mentioned delays are moot. For the record, my information regarding our potential KME was gleaned from statements from the sales rep to members on our department.

[KENTucky]

With no FDNY rigs ahead of us and their overall numbers way down, it still took Seagrave a full year to build and deliver our new Marauder II heavy rescue. IMHO....Seagrave has not been a volume builder in modern times...probably not since they moved to Clintonville from Columbus. Everything is built on site, piece by piece. Not a cab here, a chassis there, an aerial here, then they're all snapped together. Seagrave may be as close to the "old days" of building fire apparatus as anyone. Heck, some of their buildings still date back to the late 1800s. But, of course, this has hurt Seagrave as well. You get what you pay for...and with Seagrave you get a steel tank. But, it won't be built as fast, there won't be a team of rock star engineers, and it won't have the fancy engineering and gizmos. I have worked off nothing but Seagraves my entire career. That said, they HAVE to fall in line with their prices. I've heard about how many they are producing a year...and it isn't pretty. I don't think they want to lose the FDNY business...they do still have the Aerialscopes, Squads, tillers, and high-pressure pumpers coming up. I would hate to see another legend fall, especially one so dear to me.



But, heck, even Pierce is slipping...or the dosage in the Kool-Aid is diluting. Watch...Rosenbauer will overtake them in North American sales...sooner rather than later.



Kent Parrish

Louisville, KY

[Dickey]

[quote name='KENTucky' timestamp='1345252354' post='495433']



But, heck, even Pierce is slipping...or the dosage in the Kool-Aid is diluting. Watch...Rosenbauer will overtake them in North American sales...sooner rather than later.



Kent Parrish

Louisville, KY

[/quote]



We have a Rosenbauer heavy rescue on an Freightliner chassis and we have nothing but great things to say about them. The quality of the workmanship, and the customer support is fabulous! Or next engine will most likely be a Rosenbauer, especially since they make their own custom cab now.



And I think you are right, in 10 years I think Rosenbauer will be the leader! ;P

[Guest]

We have 9 Rosenbauer pumpers on Spartans here in Baltimore County. Most of our problems (minor at best) are Spartan issues. I agree customer service is great.

[Guest]

Does anyone know who the KME dealer is or would be for NYC/FDNY?

[Guest]

And not to get away from the FDNY topic, but the Rosenbauer comments might not be too far off. My dept has recently begun the process of replacing one of our ladder trucks. We met with the regional Rosenbauer dealer and according to them, they are the #1 selling apparatus manufacturer in the world with the exception of the United States. They claim they are second here in the US only to Pierce.

[Reliance]

[quote name='firemark' timestamp='1345777045' post='496183']

Does anyone know who the KME dealer is or would be for NYC/FDNY?

[/quote]

CHIEF FIRE & RESCUE APPARATUS

40 Haven Avenue

Port Washington, NY 11050

516-883-1115

www.chieffire.net

sales@chieffire.net

Bronx, Kings, Nassau, New York, Queens, Richmond, Suffolk